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Pak Tea House » Democracy, History, Islam, Pakistan, Politics, Society, Terrorism » Profile: Zaid Hamid

Profile: Zaid Hamid

by Abdul Majeed

Biography

Zaid Hamid was born in Karachi on March 14, 1964. His father, Col. Zaman Hamid (Retd), served in the Pakistan Army. Zaid spent his early life in Karachi. He received a Bachelor of Engineering (BE) degree in Computer Systems Engineering from NED University, Karachi in 1980′s.

According to the brochure published by BrassTacks, available on the website www.zaidhamid.pk. Zaid Hamid rose to the fore when he started a program named Brass Tacks on a TV channel, discussing “Economic Terrorism, CIA Threats to Pakistan, Zionist Wars against Islam and Role of Spiritual Forces in War”.
The brochure also proudly states that, “The International think tanks and media, especially the Americans and Iranians have distinctively noticed him as well. A New York Times article and documentary specially featured the impact his so falsely termed “conspiracy theories” have on the Pakistani youth”

Claim to Fame

Zaid Hamid proudly confesses taking part in the Afghan “Jihad” (which was funded by American Money and Israeli weaponry. Khulla Tazad?). Since then he has been working at Brass Tacks, a security analysis company. After the show on ARY news, he also did a show named “Iqbal ka Pakistan” on Aag TV (that program has been reviewed thoroughly by myself which can be seen here).  We will see a sample of one of the reports of BrassTacks and my comments on that afterwards.

The “Confidential Weekly Edition: Pakistan Security and Political Situation Report & Threat Analysis© 2011 BrassTacks. All Rights Reserve Issued on April 24th, 2011” available here(despite being termed confidential) states that

“What is most unfortunate is that it is the Pakistani PM who is acting as Indian Information minister and doing the bidding for the enemy state. Now it is clear that Pakistan and India would go to war on water in not so far future! With summers approaching and water shortage hitting the vital food crops, the temperature on diplomatic and military axis would also rise rapidly. Proxy war between Pakistan and India is now heating up in the entire region with regional countries also becoming the battle ground for Indian total war on Pakistani state. It is incredible that how Indian foreign office, information ministry and their leadership maintain a friendly face towards Pakistan while attacking Pakistan on all economic, diplomatic and military axis in the entire region.”

It further informs us that,
“Pakistan is not a monolithic state like Iran or Saudi Arabia rather its sectarian demography contains a sizeable Shia population among the majority Sunni. This Shia populace is well integrated with Pakistani society and is playing a vital role in
progress and development.”

Yes, Shia populace is SOO well-integrated in Pakistani Society that thousands of Shias have been killed in the last 20 years and there has not been any sectarian violence in this “Land of Peace”.
The Broucher also provides the details of Zaid Hamid’s appearances in media, and that he has appeared in multiple episodes of Thori si Siyasat with his lackey, Ahmad Qureshi.
The website zaidhamid.pk also informs us
Welcome to our battle station in a war to defend Pakistan’s Islamic ideology and national identity! This is our platform and weapon system to launch the counter attack against ideological subversion by the hostile forces through the axis of disinformation and propaganda warfare.” The website www.brasstacks.pk has only one working page, the rest is “Under Construction”.

Antagonists

Another very useful website is http://zaidhamidexposition.org/who-is-zaid-hamid/ which was instrumental in bringing his drama to a premature end in 2008-09. The problem was that this website based all its hatred and opposition of Zaid Hamid on some previous blasphemy charges of his. He successfully reinvented himself a few months after that because you just cannot fight illogical people with illogical claims. Very few serious attempts were done to understand and destroy the utopian fallacies being propagated by Zaid Hamid.

Zaid Hamid has been exposed and ridiculed in the media by columnists Fasi Zaka(whom ZH had accused of being a Jewish agent because he was a Fulbright Scholar), Nadeem Farooq Paracha and Mohammad Haneef. He has also been parodied multiple times on the Four Man Show. Despite all these efforts, he still was invited on TV channels as a “Political Analyst” while he has advocated an Anti-politician bias throughout his programs and speeches. Last year, he appeared in a program with Marvi Sirmed in which he tried to defend his delusions and myths propagated in history by the establishment.

Recently, in a program on Express News, Zaid Hamid was dealt expertly by Hasan Nisar and Ali Chishti. They ruthlessly exposed his baseless claims and so-called ideology by using facts. Not surprisingly, the very next day, Hasan Nisar was labeled as a “RAW agent” and “Anti-Pakistani, depression-creator Traitor” on the Syed Zaid Zaman Hamid[Official] page. (Interestingly, Zaid Hamid re-branded himself as “Syed” after his prosecution based on alleged links with Yousaf Kazzab, to show the world that he in-fact is a big Aashiq-e-Rasool.)
In Zaid Hamid’s universe, anyone that does not agree with him is either a traitor or Anti-Pakistan/Anti-Islam/RAW agent/Zionist.

Zaid Hamid’s Views/Ideology:

Zaid Hamid advocates the establishment of Khilafah and an Iranian style revolution. He is staunchly anti-democracy. He wants the Gold Standard back. He wants to “conquer” India. He has a different definition for “Zionists” and labels everyone whom he dislikes as a Zionist. He was one of the proponents of the “Good Taliban/Bad Taliban” theory.
He thinks Allama Iqbal was not a human being but a “spiritual” super-human. He is openly pro-establishment and wants Army to take over the political system until the Khalifa arrives. He thinks Muslims can form a political bloc to fight against the “immoral, corrupt and conspiring West”. He believes that the cause of floods in Pakistan was some secret Indian/American mission. He thinks Baloch Insurgents and TTP are foreign-funded. Zaid Hamid has changed his positions many times as well. There was no mention of Khilafah in his earlier programs, but after the “Kazzab” allegations, he took up a new name, changed his identity to a hyper-national, Spiritual, Dynamic person. In short, he is the Glenn Beck of Pakistan, without the black-board that is. Our worry is not that Zaid Hamid will get a chance to rule this country, our worry is that main stream politicians like Imran Khan have espoused the same ideologies as Zaid Hamid and this trend needs to be checked(If you do not believe this, please do watch the show Iqbal ka Pakistan, in which Imran Khan was invited to the show in episode 4 as a guest and apart from other similarities, Zaid Hamid used the word “tsunami” as a political force in episode 21). Fringe players like Zaid Hamid are present in almost every country, they shouldn’t be allowed though to enter the mainstream and affect National Discourse.

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67 Responses to "Profile: Zaid Hamid"

  1. Jamilkhakwani United States Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    Hmmmm!!! They call him LAAL TOPI WALA BALUNGDA!!

  2. aneela_shahzad Pakistan Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    AMA, you say  ”Zaid Hamid proudly confesses taking part in the Afghan “Jihad” (which was funded by American Money and Israeli weaponry. Khulla Tazad?)”
    .i think you got confused, Zaid must not have been proud because of the sources of the weapon and the money, but because of himself joining the freedom fighters or do you think that the Afgans were wrong to fight for their freedom in the first place.

  3. Ali Pakistan Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    A drawing room jihadi

  4. paktea Pakistan Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    Aneela, I used that term because I don’t believe that “Jihad” which is a holy war can be fought based on backing of people who don’t believe in this concept. The Afghan Mujahideen were being used as pawns by the U.S to fight a proxy war against USSR. I would recommend reading the pulitzer prize winning book “The Looming Tower” for a detailed story of that “Jihad” and How Al Qaeda came into being. Afghans were fighting an internal war, against their oppressors and fellow Afghans(after all, the place was being run via the Afghans all the time. (Raja Anwar in his book “The Terrorist Prince” has described his time in Afghanistan during 1980-1984), it was not Jihad. 

    AM

  5. aneela_shahzad Pakistan Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    then do you believe in ‘mal e ghanimat’  i.e. using  valuables of the other after defeating them,  do you believe that the Prophet made pact with the Jews of Khyber and bought/used weapons from them. 

    Jihad will be only for whom fight with their blood to secure their soil in identification with the religion, to their best intent and knowledge;  the users and used phenomenon will not stale the jihad phenomenon.

    bay khtar kood…..
    aqal hai mehv e tamasha lab ebam abbhi  

  6. paktea Pakistan Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    Jews were not “financing” the wars that Prophet S.A.W fought, were they? Were they using the Muslim Army to defeat the Quresh of Makka as a proxy war? From what I know this is not true. 

    You have stated a very emotional response regarding Jihad, If you get time, have a look at Mr. Maududi’s book(can be read here, named “Jihad Fil Islam.. http://www.esnips.com/doc/da815240-11ec-40a7-969e-661ef7c2b6a5/07-Al-Jihad-Fil-Islam-(By-Maududi)-%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%AC%DB%81%D8%A7%D8%AF-%D9%81%DB%8C-%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%A7%D8%B3%D9%84%D8%A7%D9%85) in which he has mentioned the “pre-requisites” of Jihad according to Ahadees and Quran. In Addition, a simplified version has been stated by Mr. Javed Ghamidi.(his booklet, The islamic Sharia of Jihad can be read here.. http://www.al-mawrid.org/pages/dl.php?book_id=53)

    AM 

  7. aneela_shahzad Pakistan Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    both these sites are blocked, but i think i have a fair idea of Jihad,  having gone through Moududi’s tafseer several times.
    No two wars can have the exact same scenario, but my question is that if there is a situation of several conspirators over a war, does this legitimize for the people to throw away their freedom and not fight for it, if their struggle is legitimate , anyone joining them in good faith is rightful too. 

  8. fingolfinn India Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    that war was not fought for religion. the afghans might have fought the war for freedom but mr zaid hamid was there because he wanted to fight for islam. tthe afghans and mr hamid would not have been able to do anything if it were not for the americans. and the regime that took power after that was hated by all afghans( the taliban) and loved by zaid hamid proving that they NEVER shared the same ideology. the average afghan hates the taliban. so obviously their reasons for fighting the war were different and mr hamid did not go there in “good faith” as you seem to think. he went there for the same reason that osama went there and that was for ” fighting for islam”. that is how delusional these people are because that fight had nothing to do with religion whatsoever. that fight was a battlefield of 2 superpowers and that fight was about afghans fighting for their freedom. there also happened to be a few delusional fools like osama and zaid hamid who thought they were fighting a war for islam but only ended up making a fool out of themselves( again read the looming tower). they were just there for all the wrong reasons. the afghans routinely made fun of them and asked them to leave.
    what happened after the war?!? this same zaid hamid became america’s worst enemy after shamelessly taking money from them for fighting the war( heights of hypocrisy?!)!
    and what about now??!! where is the great romantic jihad against america that hamid keeps talking about?! the taliban have been annihilated by the americans clearly showing that love of a religion does not win wars but power, money and brute force does. why does hamid not  join the jihad now?! because he does not have the american dollars anymore of course!!! he can now only talk nonsense comfortably ensconced in islamabad( or wherever in pakistan). such people are nothing but hypocrites and raving lunatics and should be dispatched where the rightly belong- the dustbin. 

  9. Asim Naveed Pakistan Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    Personally confirmed from Imran Khan…. He has no affiliation with this fanatic… He used to roam around him and shared some common views but that were limited to corruption and governance

  10. Anwar United States Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    So you wrote all of the details about this silly fellow only to establish  a connection between him and IK?

  11. Mustafa United Kingdom Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    I want to clarify that i despise zaid hamid for his idealogy and belief in yusuf kazab. So this is not in response to him fighting jihad.
    I want to make a couple of points, firstly
    the money was matched by saudi arabia during afghan jihad. so perhaps half of the jihad was legitimate since half the money was halal. All te money was routed via Pakistan, do you think soldiers fighting knew where the money was coming from? They were happy to receive funding to high against a communist regime.

    secondly protecting muslims from enemies is jihad, so although it was a proxy war muslims had the right to defend their land. You sight a book written by a non-muslims, why do you take every word as HAQ? What proof do you have that it is corect?
    Found a review – http://www.amazon.co.uk/product-reviews/071399973X/ref=cm_cr_dp_synop?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=0&sortBy=bySubmissionDateDescending#REPSZTTHOC2X1
    Clearly not a very well researched book but propaganda.
    If taliban had been annhilated, Americans would not be trying to open dialogue with them.

  12. paktea Pakistan Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    Amazon is perhaps not the best source  to research a book.!!! U have to read AT LEAST a chapter before deciding anything. and btw u can find it in pdf on the internet. its not a propaganda(the 1st thing that comes to our mind whenever someone refutes our viewpoint.!!). 

    AM

  13. paktea Pakistan Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    Let me quote them here, Tafseer is a different thing, a WHOLE book on that topic is different.

    According to the book Al-Jihad
    Fil-Islam written by eminent Islamic scholar Abu-al-Ala Maududi, there are
    certain definite situations when Jihad becomes obilagatory on Muslims. The
    pre-requisite conditions of waging Jihad are

    a.    There
    should be an Islamic State(i.e which is based on Sharia Laws)

    b.    governed by a Ruler who is( a Muslim and whose
    political authority has been established either through nomination by the
    previous ruler similar to how Abū Bakr transferred the reins [of his khilāfah
    to Umar] or through pledging of allegiance by the ulema or a group
    of the elite-elaboration by Javed
    Ghamidi, in his booklet The Islamic Shariah of
    Jihad, page 43, Reference from Hadith # 2533 in Sunan Abu Daud)

    c.    If
    the ruler has the moral grounds and the military might to curb the oppression
    and injustice of the country against which jihād is to be waged.

    When the head of the state declares Jihad against the enemy,
    it becomes Farz for Muslims to help
    the state fight that enemy. The Conditions in which the head of state can
    declare Jihad are

    1.To curb oppression and persecution in another country –
    whether Muslim or non-Muslim.(Surah
    Al-Hajj, Ayah 39-40)(Surah
    Bakarah, Ayah 190-191)

    2. To apprehend those who stop people from adopting the
    right path. (Surah Anfal, Ayah 36 and 47)(Surah Tauba, Ayah 9 and 34).

    3. To punish those who have reneged on promises/pacts with
    the state.(Surah Anfal, Ayah 55-58)(Surah Tauba, Ayah 1-2,5-8)

    4. Against the Internal saboteurs. (Surah Tauba, Ayah 73)
    (Surah Azhab, Ayah 60-61) (Surah Nisa, Ayah 89)

    5. To ensure Peace. (Surah Al-Maida, Ayah 33-34)

    6. To help Muslims living in a Non-Muslim states If they are
    being oppressed and they call Muslim state for help.(Surah Nisa, Ayah 75)(Surah
    Anfal, Ayah 72-73)

    7. To defend the Islamic state. (Surah Anfal, Ayah 60)Now you decide for yourself If the “Jihad” was a Jihad or just an internal affair of afghans and btw AFGHANS never called it a Jihad as has been said constantly by Masood Farivar in his book “Confessions of a Mullah Warrior”. AM

  14. paktea Pakistan Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    Not exactly. It is a profile of Zaid Hamid and how dangerous/stupid he is. I have just wondered about similarity in views of IK and ZH as I believe both got their backing from the establishment. ZH has been abandoned by the “establishment” according to my sources, don’t know yet about IK.  

    AM

  15. Anwar United States Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

     Just curious, do you have any proof that the “establishment” has abandoned ZH but still clinging on to IK? To me these are purely speculative innuendos..
    and by the way, do you know the difference between Punjabi Talibans and the Pushtoon Talibans?  If so, which brand of Taliban IK wanted to negotiate with a fairly long time ago? You may have to do some digging around but I am sure you are pretty good at it.

  16. paktea Pakistan Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    I can’t reveal my sources but “they” are seldom wrong. I have said that I don’t know the status about IK’s relation with “them”. The circumstential evidence points to the fact that ZH is pretty much a “lone warrior” these days. 

    I have studies a lot about Pashtoon Taliban and Punjabi Taliban. Pashtoon   Taliban are the ones IK wants to negotiate with, he has not officially said anything about the Punjabi Taliban while his party members(Ijaz choudary in particular) hav been attending rallies in which majority participants are either the Punjabi Taliban themselves or their allies. One of the theories(which can be totally wrong) about IK’s deep desire to negotiate with Taliban is that because he has relatives in Waziristan(from his mothers’ side) he is more sympathetic towards the Pashtoon Taliban.  
    AM

  17. aneela_shahzad Pakistan Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    AMA
    Maybe you want to establish that Jihad is no more a workable phenomenon at all, we can argue all our life on weather any country has Shariah or not,  that why i ‘m against the Mullah groups, they tend to complicate matters and nothing is eventually acheived.
    .
    The Afghans fought against an imperialistic occupying force, they fought for their soil, their freedom, their identity, and their identity is inevitably Islam. I believe in a practical Islam, based on common sense, and ‘Ijtehad’ based on common sense. And my common sense tells me that to resist an occupation will always be a higher moral ground then to put the arms down. I don’t have the gadget to measure Zaid’s intent, he has the benefit of doubt, and I give that benefit to all the soldiers and civilians who have fought with their blood
    .
    Taliban represent more then half of the Afghans, they are not hated, does the US troop give you the gadget to measure their hearts, history tells me all nations cherish their freedom fighters as heroes, why should the valorous Afghans be different. The men in Medina did not represent the whole Arab, but they represented ‘right’.  Were their battles Jihad or not?

  18. engrich United States Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    freedom fighters are loved by their people and hated and rediculed by occupiers and their locsl agents.

  19. Rex Minor Germany Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    let me try to make some corrections; Jehad is not a holy war but RESISTANCE.  The term holy war was used by the crusaders, the follower of the christian Pope, who regarded Arab forces as barbarians and organised more than once an expeditionary force headed by European monarhs and Nobility to invade Jerusalem. There is nothing holy about a war or any kind of violence in Islam.

    Afghans are notably Pashtuns and so are Talibans, all integrated as one entity within their respective tribal structures, subservient only to their tribal elders. Mr Karzai is as much a Taliban as Mullah Omar is, both very close to each other because of their tribes. They are estimmated to be mre than 50 million and are the largest group of tribes in the world. Their identity is a common language . and a common culture. Their ir faith is Islam. They are extremely allergic to those who do not speak their language and this includes their fellow citizens (tajiks, uzbeks and Hazara) as well as their neighbouring Pakistanis.

    Rex Minor

  20. Rex Minor Germany Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    AMA
    If you have studied Pashtun Talibans then you should also know that they , the Talibans or Pashtuns never negotiate!  When you hear someone saying the word negotiate with Talibans simpy means that this party is prepared to listen to Talibans and are prepared to accomodate them if possible. There are only two choices, one must accept Talibans demands or overpower them in a battle. History tells us that hey are invincible. Imran kha i simply a smart guy, so was four star General Macchrystal who was prepared to meet Talibans demands. There are others who want to confront them believin that they are the minority among the majority of Pashtuns? They simply do not understand the Afghanor Pashtun culture. Are we going to witness the 1841 once again, the clock is ticking. Mr Karzai has told the Professor of the American Law Professor to take his criminals out of the rural area of Afghanistan immediately and eventualy out of Afghanistan..  

    Rex Minor

  21. fingolfinn India Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    the taliban are by no means an ethnic group!!! why is there such a big misconception about this?! they are a militant and political group that were initially funded by america and the united states. PASHTUNS are an ethnic group. and almost all the ttaliban are pashtuns, most pashtuns are by no means taliban! to even think this is the heights of absurdity. they then captured power in 1996 and ruled in 2001 until they were thrown out by america. during the period of their reign, they enforced their interpretation of the sharia in afghanistan. their rule was so unpopular that it has come to be the  worst rule in the history of the modern world after that of hitler towrds the jews.the taliban committed massacres against the civilian afghans. they denied UN supplies to 160,000 starving afghans. they continued a policy of scorched earth burning down thousands of afghan homes and fields. thousands fled to other neighboring countries including pakistan. the afghans HATED taliban more than they have hated anyone else. they might have been freedom fighters at one point( although fighting a country as the proxy of another is not what i call freedom fighting), but after their rule the afghans hated them to the point that they preferred american rule to that of the taliban. the taliban have been the worst regime in the world for women, who were treated like slaves and i am left dumbfounded when women in this forum seem to think that this rapacious group worthy of praise. they killed, raped, butchered for the smallest of reasons. they banned education for women because they thought that the only place for a women is in the bed of her husband. women were not allowed to leave their homes without their husbands in tow! do people on this forum think that ANY populace will LIKE a group of this sort?!  the taliban are nothing but rapacious, bloodthirsty butchers who satiated their darkest fantasies in the name of allah and the sharia. 

  22. fingolfinn India Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    *i mean intially funded by saudi ( at the behest of the USA) and the united states.

  23. Anwar United States Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

     Precisely. And perhaps you can confirm from your links which of the two groups carried out most of the terrorist acts in Pakistan – including the Swat fiasco. They were all Punjabi Talibans! And that is the group IK never suggested any negotiations.
    Even the PPP lead govt is trying to facilitate negotiations with Pushtoon Talibans and other state actors – does it not, according to your thesis, make them accomplice to terrorism? Actually, way ahead of IK in terms of appeasement?
    So, what in your opinion is a smart choice – statesmanship or brinkmanship?

  24. aneela_shahzad Pakistan Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    Rex
     i don’t mean to offend you but war is truly holy in Islam, Jihad is the most prized height of  morality God demands of His bondsmen,  i am not sorry to hold the sword in my hands, even if the propaganda against it is written all through the sky.
           don’t be naive to think that vicious, blood thirsty chivalry will be abated by cross-table dialogue. 

  25. fingolfinn India Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    what part of being a proxy( a pawn) between two warring superpowers do you not understand? 

    why do so many people feel the need to romanticize the whole war as a jihad when islam or muslims in particular were not being picked on? the point of the war was not to endanger muslims but to gain an ascendancy in power which is what happened after the fall of the soviet union that the war precipitated. 

    the money that the saudi’s paid was also at the behest of the US and not done to save fellow muslims. please try and understand that muslims the world over never have and never will think as a monolith. that is why the muslim countries that time did not give a dam about the war since they knew that it was not islam that was being targeted. as humans we have always romanticized  wars. in india the conquest of muslim kings is seen by some people as a conquest of islam upon hinduism when in reality it was NEVER that. even mahmud of ghazni came to india to plunder and patronize the arts and not as the sword of islam. they all came and conquered for themselves and never for religion. that was only an excuse in the rare cases that it was used. 

    this holds true even today. religion has nothing to do with it. and if the afghan war was not targeting muslims then that means that the so called ” defense of fellow muslims” is also wholly concocted to romanticize an issue that was moving in a certain inexorable direction whether these romantics existed or not. please lets learn to glean from history outside the prism of religion. it leads to much better inference and learning. 

  26. aneela_shahzad Pakistan Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    if the whole Afghan nation ‘HATES’ the little-some  Talibans, as you boast, why don’t they catch them and turn them over to their ‘BELOVED’  US , when they have this golden chance. 
    don’t tell me the Pushtuns are not man enough to find and corner them, that the Taliban don’t have to eat  or sleep, do they have hypnotic power as well.
        every word you use here , i could easily rephrase for the US, how about ‘ the US are nothing but rapacious, bloodthirsty butchers who satiated their darkest fantasies in the name of democracy and the love of humanity’. but even more they don’t like one killing, they want to do it for years and years. 
         
      

  27. aneela_shahzad Pakistan Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    Finglofin
    some  people on this forum think that if the Afgan woman finds herself on the naked beaches of the west and in other men’s beds, she wouldn’t mind the Taliban that much, maybe she has a different prospect of dignity and sanity then you have!!

  28. fingolfinn India Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    what in the world makes you think that i am trying to defend america here! aneela i completely agree that the US can be just as bad as any bloodthirsty group but they have my thanks for temporarily sending the taliban scurrying for cover. i am a feminist and any self-respecting feminist will hate the taliban more than any other group in the world. you seem to have no idea what they have done to afghanistan and even if you do, the fact is that religion is the prism through which you glean through history which is why you will never look at anything objectively and infer correctly to the extent that just because the taliban are muslim you cant find fault with them. it is difficult to make people like you see the truth.
    and what the hell have i to ” boast” about?!?! why would my view that the afghan’s hate the taliban be a boast from me?!?! is this your lack of command over the english language or just plain stupidity? they cant hand over the taliban because fear is the most basic instinct all humans share. i am not denying that the pashtun are brave. that does not mean that they do not fear especially considering what the taliban can do/have done. not just to them but their families. added to that is the fact that the taliban hide in hills and other inaccessible terrains. not the kind of places you have homesteads of other pashtun people. they do not live in the cities any more. they are at present hiding from the US perpetuating this deadlock.

  29. fingolfinn India Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    what the hell is this?!? HA HA you seem to be painting a very clear picture of the kind of person you are! where on earth did the point of afghan women in the beaches of the west come from!?!? this is just ridiculous. afghan women hate the taliban more than anybody else. they have gone through living HELL. your establishment has painted a completely different picture because they have always been pro-taliban…..like you. 

    the afghan women have the right to decide their own future and deserve to be independent. they alone have the right to decide their future not the taliban. so if they want to go to the west or in other men’s beds you are no one to stop them. they do not deserve to be told what to do by fundoo’s like the taliban and people who share their ideology.  they deserve to be empowered in every way possible and this holds true for women all over the world. pakistani women too suffer from severe gender related problems and patriarchal societies. this has to change all over the world. i am greatly disturbed by your understanding  of a women’s place in society. that is not my view and if you do not think that that is the right view, then we can agree to disagree. 

  30. aneela_shahzad Pakistan Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    the word ‘boast ‘ was used in context of your oneness with the US and your thankfulness to it..
    my religion is the  theory i believe in, if it can be wrong so can your feminist theory be, if you believe in it, you must also believe in the destruction of the institution of marriage and family, i believe differently. it is also difficult to make people like you understand that they are stubbornly sticking to worn out beliefs that have effectively  shown there destruction in society, don’t you have any scientific progressive way of getting out of a theory.
    Here is another myth you propagate about the Talibans,  you show them as invincible super humans, at one moment everyone is negotiating with them, the other they are hidden in unfounded caves. As if they were Gog and Magog. And the Phustun, the valorous, but presently sharing only fear, and the rest of the ethnic groups seem to have all had a dose of the poppy cultivated under US auspise.

  31. Rex Minor Germany Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    Aneela Shahzad

     Though shall not kill is GOD’s commandment!! 

    Believe you me there is nothing holiness about war!  WAR is Evil and everytime it occurs on earth simply proves that we the humans are all sinners. Resistance is a human reflex and at times has led to wars and bloodshed; but let no one be proud when the human blood is spilled on earth.

    Fingolfinn
    You are too much influenced by occupiers media and therefore biased  to make the right judgement about  the status of women in the lives of  Afghan Taliban warriors.  You ignore the fact that the so called Talibans are the sons, brothers and husbands of Afghan women as well!! The Pashtun tribesmen of  Kandhar dare not look straight into the eyes of their mothers, nor stand tall infront of their  wives and children and must leave the land if any onewere  to commit an immoral act or show cowardice among his fellow tribesmen. This is their culture, their traditions and their way of life. The rest of your statements are too soft and are  not based on facts.  I find a very interesting and a detailed analysis made by Carl Forsbrg, an american who researched the tribal structure of the Qandhar tribes in 2009 at the request of the USA military, www understandingwar.org.

    Rex Minor

  32. fingolfinn India Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    rex
    when we, as outsiders learn about a situation, we learn about it through various media right? so the question is, which media do you really trust? do you trust the occupiers or do you trust the surrounding areas’ media?( in this case pakistani) because whichever media you choose to be influenced by, you are going to be biased one way or another. 

    so it all comes down to your choice. which media do you choose to be biased by?

    in this case, i may safely say that i go with the western media because what they say is being corroborated by 2 of my uncles who are working as doctors in afghanistan on a UN mission.  it all comes down to who you think is more credible. also in general, journalism in the west is miles ahead of the journalism in the east both in quality and reliability. people on this forum are influenced by what the pakistani establishment has to say and look at everythin through the prism of religion and they can see no wrong with the taliban!!! these are the dangers of choosing to be influenced by the wrong opinion( by my understanding. but no normal, neutral individual can ever think that the taliban were anything but bloodthirsty hooligans)

    and again and again i come back to the fact that the taliban are an extremist political group. in my earlier post i said that while most taliban are pashtun, most pashtun are NOT taliban. why is every one having so much difficulty comprehending this? 
    as far as the place of afghan women in society is concerned, they are treated worse than animals. why dont you read books like Khalid Hosseini’s kite runner to get an acccurate picture of what afghan women go through. you seem to be under the impression that they are respected?!? well this book, i can assure you will come as a rude shock. hosseini is an afghan who wrote about the way society in afghan culture functions.

    all i have been saying is that while i was never a fan of the society pre-taliban days, what happened during the taliban regime is only eclipsed by what hitler did to the jews and this is a fact. so while i do think that pashtun society can do with a paradigm shift in their society, i know for a fact that it is much better than what the taliban did when they were in power and the two are different. this difference must be acknowledged by all. 
    if the taliban were not hated by the larger afghan/ pashtun community, then they would not be training hard right now under indians and americans( men and women) to ensure that the taliban never return again.

  33. fingolfinn India Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    you call feminism a worn out belief and think that your feudal belief in the place of a women in society is modern and progressive?!?!? that is just plain hilarious. i have never heard a more regressive school of thought in my life. your belief iss what i have been fighting against in society and will continue to do so.

    you have absolutely no idea what feminism is all about. you might be absolutely happy being subservient to man…..that is your choice! all feminism is saying is that there should be equality between men and women in all spheres of life and that women must be empowered enough to make their own choices mo matter what the choices are. men have that freedom already but we believe that women should too. and that does not go against family and marriage. it just means that a women has the freedom to decide what to do with her life. if she wants to get married then good for her. she can be married and be a feminist as long as she is doing it of her own free volition. 

    the taliban are hidden in caves because the nato forces have taken over all the cities and towns. you can still hold talks with people who are hidden because they have their spokesmen who are not to be harmed by either party. this is the manner with which two warring groups have always communicated with each other. it does not take an einstein to figure this out. i only mentioned this because this means that the average afghan cannot rat them out since he doen not know where they live. osama was living in abottabad, a city and yet no pakistani ratted him out. am i to assume that all paksitanis were sympathetic towards what he did in 9/11?!? that is just ridiculous. let me put this in the simplest way possible for you to understand. WHEN PEOPLE HIDE, OTHERS DO NOT KNOW WHERE THEY ARE OK?! that is the point of hiding and that is what the taliban are doing right now. 

  34. fingolfinn India Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    rex
    as far as your understanding of war and jihad is concerned i completely and unequivocally agree.

  35. aneela_shahzad Pakistan Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    fingolfini  wish you had the same sympathy for the Afghan men,  man and woman are two sides of the same coin, they make the family,the code of nature’s law is ‘they are happy together and depressed apart’ . the vicious western man had become so habitual to his ruthless  ’divide and rule’  formula that eventually he struck on his own home, he cut the man from the woman, gave her voice, of rebellion, so that he could make her into a work force, and use every possible part of her in industry.

    ‘Divide’ that’s the golden word, that makes them the kings, they divide the shia from the sunni, the minority from the majority, the Baloch from the Punjabbi,  they make commotion and hatred in every previous harmony and peace, until one day we will be left with the  torn out ‘individual ‘ clutching to bare survival. 

  36. aneela_shahzad Pakistan Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    sorry for spelling your name wrong, 

  37. Lordoftherings India Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    Allahtaala, Aise Jaanbaaz Bahadur Sipahi Pakistan ko aur zayada se zayada de! ameen suma ameen.

  38. Raison Germany Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    to rex

    The pashtun may respect his own mother and sister – but does he respect someone else’s mother and sister (or wife)? The same question about muslims as a whole.

    As regards being influenced by foreign occupiers – the agents of the arab religion (far from outside of the indian subcontinent) are the foreign occupiers and manipulators (through bribes, intimidations and cruelties). Why allow yourself to be influeneced by them?

  39. fingolfinn India Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    no i will never have any sympathy for afghan men as far as their views on how to treat their women is concerned. the one belief i hold as sacred as you hold allah is “freedom”. to me only freedom is sacrosanct. freedom to live ones life according to ones own wishes. 
    in the afghan system, marriage means a women becomes her husbands slave. she cannot do anything out of her husbands wishes.  if she does she gets her nose, eyes and ears cut of at best. at worst she is just beheaded. if this is what a family means then to hell with it.  the burqa is what the muslim world uses to keep their women subservient. at no point does any muslim holy text ask the  women to wear such a garment. this is created by men to force women to do as they are told. it is nauseating. again you seem to misunderstand. the western concept of feminism is just to allow the women to make her own choices because the belief is that women are as intelligent as men. by disallowing this, you are in effect saying that women do not have the same intelligence as men ad therefore need to be told what to do. this is an idea that i find repellent. i respect the judgment and intelligence of women. i believe they are capable of making decision for themselves. in this one life, they have the right to live as they please rather than live as another man pleases. 

    and this is where zaid hamid comes in and his influence is so clear on you. they( the west) did not divide! we divided and they just used that division to their fullest advantage( being as clever and intelligent as they are). they did not create shia sunni, shudra brahmin, we did! they just used that division well. to blame the west for all our problems is something all pakistan’s intellectual elite including Hassan Nissar warn against. we are to blame for our problems not them. they never created any division. if they did and if e were so beautifully above these differences, then why do they still exist now that west has gone?! it is because we keep trying to find new division to fight against even when old ones disappear. an example of this is when hindu’s disappeared from pakistan because of these divisions, the people could not suddenly become inclusive because their ideology was divisive( since divisiveness was the rationale of pakistan) so they picked on new enemies – ahmedia and shia to fight against. once your ideology becomes divisive, you cannot live with anybody and will keep trying to make your society more and more homogenous. this is the problem of the entire subcontinent( although india, because of its secularism is faring a little better) these division were created long before they came. they just came, saw and conquered.    

  40. Raison Germany Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    To rex

    I am not always around to protect my mother, sister or wife or daughter. So I wish to live in a society where other men – men who are not their sons, brothers etc. – too respect and protect them. Unfortunately that is not the case in societies based on this arab religion and tribalism. Look what is being done to hindus, esp. their women in Pakistan. Mohammad himself distributed women among his most fanatic male collborators as if these “conquered” women ware objects to be passed around. Read the hadith. Those who believe in only one god are bound to discard the rights of those who don’t believe in this same god or any god. Monotheism is by nature totalitarian, imperialist, arrogant and fascistic. Monotheists like to spread propaganda that it is not so. But some like Zaid Hamid are honest and reveal the true nature and intentions of this arab religion.

  41. Rex Minor Germany Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    @fingolfinn:disqus  
    Apparently you are just a regular person who means no harm to the innocent: I am an outsider as well and this is what I do. I do not trust any western media per say without making certain allowance for a number of factors.!

    NYTimes= NYsemite, Washington Times=Washington semite, Therefore the papers must be somewhat biased. They also pay the corrupt administration people and there have the access to secret info.

     I also use my knowledge of different languages and different cultures and research the info which is poured out in cable networks, newspapers and magazines etc, evaluate them and using my judgement and speculative logic, try to determine somewhat near the truth. 
    You said your relatives are in Afghanistan, I would trust them if and only if they are familiar with the Pashto language and Afghan culture.

    This is not to say that Pashtuns or talibans are better people than non pashtuns. Human failures is part of of us.  Now just thnk for a moment, you refered to the training which the Indians and Americans are providing to Afghans without realising that at the age of five the Afghans learn to shoot and at the age of 16-18, they become smipers, one of the best. They can shoot down a helicoptrr and a plane with the rifle bullet and if they have a stinger, they are not afraid to stand straigh and take a shot at the low flying aircraft. They do not need training, this is simply a camuflage. Mr Karzai is a Pashtun and a Tliban.

    Both Indian and Pakistan societies are roughly two centuries behind the European civilisation, whereas the Afghan society is even more than two centuries behind the Western civilisation and infact do not have the kind of structures one needs to establish a democracy which is somewhat nearer to the European model. Therefore we must not expect that Afghanistan is going to follow the American equivalent societies in the next decade.

    Rex Minor

  42. Rex Minor Germany Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    Raison,
    Why do’nt you ask your question to a Pashtun? I do not understand your bickering about arab religion? The cradle of the world civilization is the middle east, not far east! Is it not about time to come out of your love for the prehistoric subcontinent. We are now in the 12st century. There is nothing arabic orAmerican in the global village. We must not tempt ourelves to initiate a clash of civilisation. Humans do not need it and I am just one human. Have a nice day.

    Rex Minor

  43. Raison Germany Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    to rex

    1)
    You really are in the 12 th century. It was no typing mistake on your part.
    2)I don’t know who is a pashtun or who is not – but you do defend them and threaten in their name as if you were one.
    3)
    I have no love for any prehistoric subcontinent. You are confusing me with someone else. But you certainly have an obsequious relationship to arab imperialism and prefer to be their minion.
    4)Civilizations started at many places – not just east or west. You are shooting yourself in the foot by claiming that it all started in the middle east. The arab religion however is now definitely a hindrance to civilzational development. But some wish to remain in 7th century tribalism and 7th century finalist fascism. Civilizations have many cradles – but you are still wrapped up in the 7th century arab cradle and sucking your baby-thumb in it.   

  44. Rex Minor Germany Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    PS
    correction 21st century! Let us talk at that level.

  45. aneela_shahzad Pakistan Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    flingolfin
    .         .WOW! you can be so one sided when you want to!  when you talk of feminism, you are talking of an ideology against an ideology , that is Islam. you are not ready to observe the vices this ideology brings with itself, you  keep insisting on equal rights to choose (Islam give me equality), but you don’t define  the limits of this choice, does she have choice to become a murderer or an adulterer , or break the family, i think nor man or woman can be allowed such heinous crimes,  unless your in for ‘Naturalism ‘ now.
    .        all societies have their vices, the Phustun must have too, but your attack goes from beyond their vice and right into the heart of their belief system, which i believe is Islam,their way maybe  in need of correction, but not in need of your daisy-cutting.
    . .Our divides are ours, i despise them, but the western church is more divided,  secularism has not fared well in lessening divides, only in abandoning  belief in all.  So you say , using other’s weaknesses,  flaring hatred among them, confronting them by false-flag operations, that is the intellegence of the west. they divided  shia sunni in Iraq,  the ethnics populace in Afghanistan, now they are after our Baluchistan…..Now  I see what morals you and your beloved stand on 

  46. fingolfinn India Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    yup. what you say as far as understanding a culture is perfectly true. that is the way i approach it too. but what i am trying to tell you is that there is a distinct difference between trying to understand a culture and trying to get facts to understand the present situation of a country. they are two different things. 
    trust me i do not “understand” the pashtun culture from the west and this is where i think you got me wrong. the thing is, india, by virtue of being so diverse, has many afghans and people of afghan descent so i get a first hand insight into their lives. and trust me i love the pathans for their passion and their amiable dispositions. a pashtoon is the easiest to make friends with and least stuck up. plus indians love the afghans because of the whole culture of the kabulliwala. if you dont know what that is, you can look it up.

    nut when you are trying to find out what is happening in afghanistan and you want just the facts then you have to trust such sources as you have at your disposal. and this is where i trust the western media because they do present “facts” accurately. they simply cant make up stuff because the consequences are too steep to try such a thing. it is unheard of. and the uncles i mentioned are maxiliary surgeons so they treat afghans first hand. they dont get their news from someone else. they treat afghan women for the crimes that their husbands commit upon them for the sake of their honor. and afghan people can speak hindi so my relatives have a pretty reliable source of information about the way things function there.

    and i dont know where you get your information from but afghan kids do not start using the rifle as soon as they turn 5. i think you have fallen victim to some low quality journalism in this case my friend. what you say maybe true for taliban kids but like i said they form a very small minority of the populace. and karzai is pashtun not taliban because taliban is a draconian political group whereas pashtun is an ethnic group. its like the nazi party were a political group whereas Aryans are an ethnic group. you can join the first if you want but you are born into the second and you cannot do anything about it.

    and yes india and pakistan are behind the west when it comes to social evolution. i am just saying that i WANT the east to impart feminism and freedom like tthe west. i am not saying that that i how we are or that is how we should look at the situation. i am just saying that that is what i want to see in the future.  

  47. fingolfinn India Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    *AND when you are trying to find out what is happening in afghanistan and you want just the facts then you have to trust such sources as you have at your disposal. and this is where i trust the western media because they do present “facts” accurately.
    sorry i dont know what kind of a typo i made there! lol

  48. fingolfinn India Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

    aneela
    why is it that whenever i am typing a post ot you i am always trying to
    correct your gross misconceptions? do you intentionally do it? or is it
    something you just cant help and you feel insecure about the ideology of
    freedom and what it does to your own ideology?

    so again let me for the millionth time make some clarifications to you.
    my explanation to you in the earlier post was not against Islam. feminism and freedom are not against any specific ideology. if any ideology is against feminism and freedom then it is against it. so when i used the example of the burqa, i was not going against islam( since i even said the quran does not ask for it). i was going against people who practice islam that way. none of my muslim friends wear a burqa! in fact they are all vehemently against it. i hope you understood the difference. some hindu communities follow pardah and my ideology is against them too. what you have to understand is that there is no fixed idea called “Islam”. there are just interpretations of what people think Islam is all about. the Koran is interpreted in millions of ways. everyone thinks theirs is right. i think the interpretation of Islam where everybody respects each others freedom, is the correct Islam(my personal opinion). as far as freedom is concerned learn this-” you can practice your freedom as long as it does not infringe upon anothers” to make it still more clear to you lets just say that you cannot become a killer because that infringes upon the right off another persons to live ok?!? you cannot stop another person from speaking his mind or doing the things he/she wants to do as long as you do not infringe upon the other persons freedom. so supposing an afghan muslim women wants to marry a christian, then that is her right and no one can stop her from doing it because while it may hurt the other afghans it does not violate their freedom. if they feel hurt then too bloody bad. their is a difference in feeling hurt and violation of freedom. but if the same afghan women wants to get some other pious muslim afghan woman married to christian against her wishes, then that is a violation of the pious woman’s freedom. so i am against any ideology that does not respect the other persons freedom. so if the quran says that a kafir can be killed then i am strictly against it. same holds true for hinduism, christianity, judaism etc. hope you finally understood what i mean by freedom. to me if my freedom is sacred, then another persons freedom is equally sacred. and if i dont want anyone to violate my freedom, then i should never violate anyone else’s freedom. thus my utopia, or my ideal society is where everyone respects one-another’s freedom. if you do this, then there is no problem, no confusion. as far as secularism is concerned again you have a huge misconception. secularism does not mean lack of belief!!!!! it just means respecting every religion equally and understanding that no religion  is superior to another. so everyone practice their own faith but to not undermine the other persons faith. living in pakistan you would not know the first thing about secularism so i do not think that you have any idea what you are talking about. lack of belief is what china practices. india remains deeply religious and secular at the same time. and for the last time i am not saying that the west did something “GOOD” by exploiting the existing divisions among us. but they were very clever in the way they did it. just because i call someone clever that does not mean i think what he did is good. just acknowledging the brains behind a draconian policy. and they might have done it then. they are not doing it now. on the one hand you talk about divisions sadly on the other hand you are against secularism? pakistan is extremist today because the rationale behind the creation of pakistan is divisive. pakistam was created to create a more homogeneous society. after you killed all the hindu’s your basic divisive attitude has not changed because it cannot change. if it changes, the reason for the creation of pakistan will cease to exist. so you have to find new “enemies” and now shia’s and ahmedia’s have started to die. dont blame baluchistan on the west!! blame it on how you have treated them all these years. blame it on the fact that you do not have democracy and that is why the baluch have never seen equal representation. this is what happens when you dont have democracy.and this is why is feel that secularism must come to pakistan like jinnah amd ayub khan wanted.so that your attitude changes to inclusiveness rather than divisiveness so that you can live with anybody and everybody. if that does not happen, pakistan’s problems will never end.  

     

  49. fingolfinn India Unknow Browser Unknow Os says:

     this is why *I feel that secularism must come to pakistan like jinnah and ayub khan wanted.

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