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Why is Imran Khan Endorsing Purana Pakistan?

Most of you have probably by now heard of the Ahmadi-Imran Khan brouhaha of the past few days where the PTI central media cell, and then Imran Khan himself, issued statements that they are in no way soliciting the support of the Ahmadi community, that Khan has “an absolute belief in the finality of Prophet Muhammad PBUH”, and that PTI “totally subscribes to” and has no plans to amend the clauses of the Constitution that brand Ahmadis non-Muslims and liars (you can see a good summary of the whole episode here).
I assume most of you are deeply troubled by this. I am, to the extent that I’m questioning my (until yesterday) almost-made decision to vote for PTI. But this isn’t about trying to convince anyone not to vote for PTI or for anyone else though. It’s not really about voting at all. This is also not a defense of any other party or their actions, nor does it imply that they would do or have done any differently in how religious minorities, and more broadly the issue of extremism is treated. We all know both the original sin of the PPP in 1974 to amend the Constitution, and the PML-N’s indefensible political expediency in soliciting banned and extremist organizations’ support in this campaign. This post is however, a set of questions for the potentially-next leader of Pakistan that I’d like addressed, especially as a potential PTI voter.
For a man and a party whose fundamental premise has been to challenge and dismantle the oppressive, corrupt structures of power that the political elite have entrenched themselves in, it begs a few questions of exactly how PTI and Khan would respond to the resistance this very elite puts up if/when a government led by them tries to implement their vision of a ‘Naya Pakistan’. Anyone, anywhere who has tried to reform such systems and displace entrenched political elites has faced massive resistance to them. More often than not, they have failed to live up to expectations and at worse become just another part of the same system.
There’s a reason why ‘wohi purane chehre’ end up being in power repeatedly despite most people preferring that they weren’t. To make an obvious point, change is hard. Changing structures of power is extremely hard. For the ‘inqilabi’ change of the kind promised by Khan, it is not enough just to have ‘good, clean people’ (though necessary), he has to tackle these structures and change the narratives that support hold them up which have led Pakistan to its current predicament. In many ways, PTI has already chipped away large chunks of the pillars of the ‘purana Pakistan’, for which it deserves a lot of credit – politicizing a previously apolitical demographic, holding proper internal party elections, becoming a genuine third force, and most importantly consistently being committed to operating within Constitutional and democratic means.
One of the entrenched pillars of the ‘purana Pakistan’ we (I assume again) want to abolish is the discrimination and marginalization that’s been heavily institutionalized within the Pakistani state against religious minorities (which is especially perverse against Ahmadis, who have the honour of being discriminated against with their very own constitutional amendment). This structure has of course been cultivated and continues to be perpetuated with state support and the public discourses of Islam as imagined and interpreted by the right, extreme right, and extremely right wing (which seems to be the range of the political spectrum within which the major political parties fall into in Pakistan).
This structure and the discourses it flows from are what lets YouTube still remain banned. Why in order to register to vote or get a passport, you have to legally acknowledge that Ahmadis are liars and fakes (a ridiculous notion that in order to exercise your fundamental rights, you have to become party to denying them to a whole community). It’s what hampers us from pursuing normal relations with India even though all major parties, the majority of the population, and now even our Generals, support it. It’s what enables the Hudood Ordinances and blasphemy laws to remain, what allows the ridiculous applications of Articles 62/63 we saw in the candidate scrutiny process. At its worse, it’s metastasized into all too frequent violence against minorities (think Badami Bagh, Rimsha Masih, etc.), and questioning the faith and patriotism of those who support them, to violent ends (Salmaan Taseer-Mumtaz Qadri). It’s what allows hate-based groups such as the Taliban, Sipah-e-Sahaba/ASWJ/LEJ to claim some legitimacy because, after all, they are promoting and defending ‘Islam’, and we have to treat with some deference anyone claiming to be acting in the name of the faith.
So it in this context that Imran Khan and PTI are operating. It’s a tough environment to speak out in. I appreciate that. You could lose a lot of votes, be labeled a traitor/foreign agent, and at worse get violently attacked. But with this ‘controversy’, manufactured by the very forces that thrive on bigotry, here was an opportunity for Imran Khan to either ignore or denounce this politics of discrimination. Instead, he completely capitulated. No qualifications. ‘I, Imran Khan, indisputably reaffirm my faith in institutionalized bigotry and want to reassure you I have no plans to do anything about it’, he seemed to say. It was painful to watch for all of us who have a rock-solid belief in the man’s integrity, whatever our other disagreements with him might be, and who promised (as does PTI’s manifesto) protection of minorities (not to mention how immeasurably worse it would be for minorities to hear).
His statement was an overt acknowledgement, endorsement, and buy-in of the disproportionate power these forces enjoy in setting the parameters of public discourse, and by consequence public policy, in Pakistan. Those parameters over the past few years seem only to be shifting more and more towards the right and the ridiculous, where people like Hafiz Saeed and Mohammad Ahmad Ludhianvi are now regularly on mainstream media outlets and even run for Parliament. Khan, with the popular support he’s built up, has some power to challenge these parameters. That is, after all, what he has done with the political elite by successfully challenging dynasty and corruption. Yet instead of moving the discussion on minorities and religion towards a more “enlightened” state, where it’s okay to solicit votes from Ahmadis and treat them as citizens with rights (gasp!), he seems to have pitched his tent firmly within the status quo.
The political and militant groups that peddle the narratives of hate are also now important political and economic actors (the ‘new feudals’ in parts of the country) and so any government led by PTI cannot achieve what it says it wants without fundamentally questioning their place in the structures of power. So when Imran Khan makes this statement, I question what it means for building the PTI manifesto’s ‘Naya Pakistan’, when he feels so moved by a few “religious” parties cutting into his vote bank and by a viral SMS and Facebook campaign questioning why Ahmadis should be treated like other Pakistanis with rights.
Another example, PTI’s manifesto, rightly, proposes land reforms. What happens when the landlords we so detest hop back onto the ‘land reforms are haraam’ train? It was a similar skewed discourse of Islam that put a stop to them, when the Federal Shariat Court declared them un-Islamic. And, what happens when, assuming he’s serious about land reforms, he takes on the largest landlord and corporate empire in the country, the military? Their former leaders may be down on luck these days but they remain very good at running viral rumour campaigns and mobilizing the kind of ideological groups that led Imran to issue this statement.
It is of course, a bit unfair to only blame Imran Khan. I doubt he wanted to be drawn into this, and he is right that it is politically motivated. The problem is larger than a single public figure or party and it will take more than one election campaign or video statement to tackle. The counter to this is ‘yes, this episode is terrible, but who else would you vote for?’ Honestly, I don’t know, but for a party which promised to challenge all those structures that have put Pakistan in its current malaise, to refuse to engage one the most malignant is at best disheartening and disappointing, and at worse, sapping of any hope for real change. And if PTI cannot promise real change, why are we voting for them?

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45 Responses to "Why is Imran Khan Endorsing Purana Pakistan?"

  1. Babar Pakistan Google Chrome Windows says:

    Why not vote for PPP. They are most liberal in the current lot and their record in the last five years has been very good.

  2. Sohail Qureshi Pakistan Google Chrome Windows says:

    It was an unfortunate episode. Being a PTI supporter, I was shaken. But I also understood the fact that being wrong at so many levels it might have been a necessary step. We should not forget Imran’s stance on AHmedi persecution when their masjid was attacked in Lahore. When everyone was saying ahmadi “ibadat-gah” he was the only one to call it ahmadi mosque. I wish it wouldn’t have happened.

  3. Majumdar India Google Chrome Windows says:

    It is better to bet for PMLN. They are no more illiberal than the other lot, at least they are good for business, good for governance.

    Regards

  4. Majumdar India Google Chrome Windows says:

    It is better to bet for PMLN. They are no more illiberal than the other lot, at least they are good for business, good for governance.
    .
    Regards

  5. sunny Germany Mozilla Firefox Windows says:

    What a dire situation has come upon Pakistan due to islam.
    No good parties, no good leaders, no good constitution, no good media/press, no good education, no honesty, no respect for life, no respect/protection for hindus…

    All because of this fascist totalitarian arab imperialism and 7th century god-concept.

    -
    Every finalism is a fascism (or ends in or leads to fascism).

    Be it of a book or prophet or leader or ideology or religion.

    How idiotized the muslims due to islam.

    -
    God hath unjustly punished India/hindus by giving them Pakistan/muslims as neighbours.

  6. Rex Minor Germany Google Chrome Windows says:

    Imran Khan statement is staight forward, I AM ONE OF THE ESTABLISHMENT!
    This is honest but automaticaly disqualifies him because of his parroting slogans of a ‘Change’.

    Is it difficult to speculate that IK is the approved member of the CIA club and a collegue of Musharaf and Bhutto Zardari? This leaves the Sharif dynasty who as a statesman recently said about revising the treaty with the USA with regard to wa on terror.

    Pakistanis have no alternative but to go for a second hand politician. This is no different than the choice the Germans are to have in coming months to select fom the second hand as well.

    The golden rule in democracies is never to return the same Government, unless they were par excellence?

    Rex Minor

  7. Tommy United States Internet Explorer Windows says:

    IK cannot distance himself from Ulema..aka… Mullahs….. He had to do to Siva Lingam at the Mullahs before stepping into Politial Scene… Retd Air Marshall Asghar Khan supported IK all the way but dropped his support when he heard that IK performed siva lingam on Mullahs.
    I wish IK well and I hope Pakistanis finally find a leader to their liking and the leader doesn’t distance other minority constituents.

    One parallel that I would like to draw is that no American Presidential Candidate will go against the Second Amendment (right to bear arms) it is a political suicide….

    At times issues like this need to be simmered for years/generations till a change occurs…. Ahmadi problem started is roughly 40 years old….given time and sensibilities I have hope that this will be removed as well.

  8. sunny Germany Mozilla Firefox Windows says:

    No good leaders will come up in islam-based societies. Islam teaches muslims to be mental slaves of lies, wealth, self-deceit and sex and to hate jews and hindus as a past time, or as a “sure” means of getting a place in the fascist arab god’s degenerated “heaven”.

    -

    What a dire situation has come upon Pakistan due to islam.
    No good parties, no good leaders, no good constitution, no good media/press, no good education, no honesty, no respect for life, no respect/protection for hindus…

    All because of this fascist totalitarian arab imperialism and 7th century god-concept.
    -

    Will muslims liberate themselves from islam and its fascism and lies?

  9. romain United States Internet Explorer Windows says:

    Any politician needs to first win an election before he can bring about change. If the majority of the voters believe that Ahmedais are not muslim, it should not be suprise that Imran is being advised to make the statements that he is. I dont think Imran gives two hoots about who is a muslim and who is not.

    Would the author have Imran lose an election on a principle or win an election and do good?

  10. Shahzad United States Mozilla Firefox Windows says:

    Sign of a great leader is to lead, and not be led by the people!

  11. Thomas United States Mozilla Firefox Mac OS says:

    PLEEEZZEE……. GET REAL…….

    No.1 This is a non-issue….. If “new” post Mohamed prophets purporting to deliver Allah’s latest pronouncements to the Umah were allowed to proliferate, every crackpot, of any ilk, well meaning AND malicious would soon destroy Islam!.. Look how bad things are NOW…!! As governments from Saudi to England seek to “supervise” the Mullahs and sterilize their message.. “The Queen is good, Jihad is bad”
    Nothing would please Islam’s enemies more than allowing endless bickering and outright war over who is the current profit of Allah… There is enough division already amongst Muslims..

    No.2 I wish IK could have simply stated that “he believes” Amadis are wrong in his opinion about ‘new prophets’

  12. Thomas United States Mozilla Firefox Mac OS says:

    Sorry about my unfortunate spelling error!! It was inadvertent. It’s midnight here and I am very tired.

  13. Thomas United States Mozilla Firefox Mac OS says:

    “Babar says:
    May 6, 2013 at 1:44 pm

    Why not vote for PPP. They are most liberal in the current lot and their record in the last five years has been very good.”

    Good for whom…????? R U saying everything is wonderful….????? Where is this place..???. Wonderful for whom….??? Do you shop..??? Do you use electricity….??? Where….????

  14. Truthful United Kingdom Google Chrome Windows says:

    @Thomas “Good for whom…????? R U saying everything is wonderful….????? Where is this place..???. Wonderful for whom….??? Do you shop..??? Do you use electricity….??? Where….????”
    Don’t you think that Babar, living in Pakistan, knows more about local conditions, then somebody (like you) who is sitting in the US of A.

  15. Thomas United States Mozilla Firefox Mac OS says:

    “Don’t you think that Babar, living in Pakistan, knows more about local conditions, then somebody (like you) who is sitting in the US of A.”

    Yes truthful, I believe ‘Babar, living in Pakistan, knows more about local conditions, then somebody (like me) who is sitting in the US of A.

    What I believe is that Babar is speaking for himself and his “liberal” [university educated] English speaking privileged friends and family that comprise the 1% [landlords?] and he is ignoring the chaos, squalor and economic privations that constitute life for the 99% in Pakistan.

    I will leave it to you Truthful to decide if the vast majority of citizens of Pakistan are happy with current conditions, current prices and the current priorities of PPP government under Zadari……

    What I see HERE on the ground in the “in the US of A” is racial superiority and ‘we know what’s best for “them” paternalism, which is to a great extent driven buy oil interests lobysts, hired public relations “experts” and an anti-Muslim Jewish owned media.

    Somebody needs a reality check! Maybe it’s me… Let’s wait until after your election …….. to see what it tells us.

  16. Kamath. Canada Safari iPad says:

    Thomas, : “Sorry about my unfortunate spelling error”. Don’t worry my friend about spelling errors. Ideas are more important than correct spelling. You are not in an elementary school with school teacher looking over your shoulder. So carry on with your ideas mon ami!

  17. Sardar KHAN United Kingdom Internet Explorer Windows says:

    I don’t know why you are so against Islam.The day you so called liberals/seculars accept,that Pakistan was for the enforcement of Islamic Sharia Laws,then you will real peace.Pakistanis are muslim and are in majority and any leader worth a penny knows it.Imran Khan was right in pointing out that Constituition of Pakistan declares Mirzais/qadianis/ahmedis as non muslim.Therefore,the Constituition Of Islamic Republic Of Pakistan must be followed in letter and spirit.Tough luck for you liberals/seculars.

  18. Shahzad United States Internet Explorer Windows says:

    Ideas and approach should be beyond elementary though!

  19. Shahzad United States Internet Explorer Windows says:

    @Sardar: Well…. the constitution was created by the group of 72. Good luck with that. Hope you are right and it does not conflict with the basic principals of any religion esp. Islam. The two constitutions may not agree with each other, and at that time let me know which side you would pick!

  20. basant Germany Mozilla Firefox Windows says:

    To sardar khan

    You don’t know why we are against islam because islam has kept you ignorant of the fascism in islam. Islam uses you for its fascism and arab racism. You are not ready to open your eyes to the reality of fascism in islam.

    An islam-based society may or may not have been good in 7th century Makkah. But today in 2013 it is definitely evil and dangerous. And the muslim contries, esp. Pakistan, prove this.

  21. Rex Minor Germany Google Chrome Windows says:

    @SardarKhan

    Sir, in principle you are right to claim that the State of Pakistan was solely created by the muslims majority and for the muslims as an independent Islamic Republic. However, there was nothing extraordinary in this concept; muslims had ruled united India for centuries before the Britisch colonalised the sub-continent due to the incompetance of the so called moghul Emperor rulers who went into the spree of luxary and sexism and lived the lives which the Rajas and Maharajas of India were used to and consequently had no united force to resist.

    This is history of Indian muslims; the history of other muslm counties in three continents of the world is not a secret either. The question threfore comes to the minds of many as to what sort of a muslim State the majority of Pakistanis have in their mind of being coached for.
    It is motherhood for evey muslim to speak of Sharia, but most do not have the faintest idea what they mean. Sharia is simply a set of laws which a community of muslims, a state of muslims and a republic of muslims which with a consense(democracy) establish the laws requied to hold th social fabric and stuctures of the community as well as to protect the rights of its citizens against the internal and th external regressive forces. They must also reflect the values of Islam in terms of fairness and justice.

    Th implant of ancient traditions and practices of Pagans before the advent of Islam, some of which were practiced by ruthless and cruel dictators of thei tims during and after the 7th century period and certain countries including Pakistan still have in force has nothing in common with the Ilamic values. Islam does not permit inquisitions nor ex-communication nor encourages violence or condones killings. They are all develish and Evil acts.

    Now Mr Khan, tell us what sort of Sharia you refered to? And who is the best politician who is going to uphold the values of Islam?

    Rex Minor

  22. Rex Minor Germany Google Chrome Windows says:

    PS
    It is suprising to note that your next doo neighbours are the most ignorants about Islam, despit having lived as the most protcted itizns during the muslim rule. The christian rulers under the dictatorial control of the Church managed to annhilate all non-believers in the European and the American continents.

  23. Rex Minor Germany Google Chrome Windows says:

    Imran Khan has been bowled out. Too bad, the choice of casting the vote for a newcomer has disappeared. People now have the choice to select from the second hand candidates.

    Rex Minor

  24. tajender United Arab Emirates Internet Explorer Windows says:

    Rex Minor says:
    May 8, 2013 at 9:21 pm
    Imran Khan has been bowled out. Too bad, the choice of casting the vote for a newcomer has disappeared. People now have the choice to select from the second hand candidates

    forces of change failed though had majority support.status-quo remained in power,only face has change.

  25. tajender United Arab Emirates Mozilla Firefox Windows says:

    rex an interesting intructions from london to british rulers of india,

    Viceroy, Lord Dufferin (1884-88), was advised by the secretary of state in
    London that the “division of religious feelings is greatly to our advantage ’’,
    & that he expected “some good as a result of your committee of inquiry on
    Indian education & on teaching material ’’. “ We have maintained our power
    in India by playing – off one part against the other’’, the secretary of state
    for India reminded yet another viceroy, Lord Elgin (1862-63), “& we must
    continue to do so. Do all you can, therefore to prevent all having a common
    feeling?

  26. Saniya Ahmad Pakistan Mozilla Firefox Windows says:

    What I fail to understand is why couldn’t he just have avoided this statement instead of speaking about it so openly?
    Furthermore, why does religion have to be the base on which Ahmadis are not being given their rights? Are they not human? Have they been involved in any kind of violence? What is their fault? That they have a different set of belief? It’s not only immature, but you’re also showing the world that you have no tolerance, and you can’t protect the rights of, religious minorities and that it doesn’t matter to you whether they live or die; you’d rather prefer to get rid of them, or put them in jail. Why? Because of their belief. Ridiculous.

  27. kaalchakra United States Google Chrome Windows says:

    Saniya, much can be legitimately held against IK. But in this case he was not wrong. Please remember, Islam is VERY VERY important to Pakistan. The nation’s constitution explicitly states that nothing contrary to Islam can be allowed or accepted.

    All of us agree that that is how it ought to be. Who would like to stand against Islam? Certainly not you, we can be sure.

    Once we have that agreement, it becomes unrealistic and plain illogical to expect that people be allowed to change Islam randomly or, worse, defeat the whole intent of Pakistani constitution and nationhood by promoting things contrary to Islam by just the simple sufism of renaming things.

    Put differently, this is NOT a matter for God to decide. God made Islam. People decide to follow it. People decide to live by it. In order to be able to do so, people (not God) must decide what Islam is, for themselves and for their common life.

    For IK to avoid clarifying his position on such a fundamentally important issue to the nation would have been immoral and counterproductive.

    Best.

  28. Saniya Ahmad Pakistan Google Chrome Windows says:

    I won’t get into the debate of whether Ahmadis are Muslims or non-Muslims, but if you say that Allah has made a specific set of rules in Islam to follow, why is it that we have 73 sects in Islam? Obviously, every sect has something different in their belief, hence the difference of a sect, right?
    That aside, constitution still does not get to single out any specific minority and not give them any rights or security. I agree Islam is VERY important to our nation since we are an Islamic state and all practising Muslims I believe. However, do you really think Ahmadis would go around calling themselves Muslims if they weren’t? Or prayed 5 times a day, or recited the Quran or fast? Do you really think that this many people wouldn’t be following their faith, standing firm, if they didn’t think it was true? Have you ever thought of it this way?

  29. Maggu India Safari iPad says:

    “Muhammad Yaqoob, a member of the United Khatam-i-Nabuwat told The Express Tribune that they had laid siege to the office to “Get God’s blessings”. He said the magazine carried blasphemous content and should be banned. He said at least eight of their men remained at the office to prevent Ahmadis from entering the office and removing material from it. “We will remove it ourselves with help from the police after we manage to have an FIR registered against them under blasphemy laws,” he said.
    .
    He said an additional sessions judge had ordered the registration of an FIR, but the police were favouring the Ahmadis by not registering it.
    .
    He said a contempt of court petition had been moved before the Lahore High Court for the implementation of the court’s orders for the registration of an FIR. According to Yaqoob’s application, he requested the police to register an FIR under Sections 298-C, 295 (B), 295 (C) and Section 11-W of the Anti Terrorism Act against magazine publisher Mian Muhammad Shah Jee, editor Yasir Zervi, Yasir Mansoor Ahmed and two others. He said that he had seen Yasir Zervi and two others circulating copies of the magazine on April 23. He said he too was given a copy of the magazine and had found blasphemous content in it.
    .
    .
    Now, aren’t there easier ways to get gods blessings?
    .
    .
    Ahmedis now have to be dealt with thru and anti terrorist law?

  30. kaalchakra United States Safari  Android 4.0.4 LG-MS770 Build/IMM76I says:

    Maggu, stopping vice is just as important as promoting virtue.

  31. kaalchakra United States Safari  Android 4.0.4 LG-MS770 Build/IMM76I says:

    Dear Sania, it is not for you and I to understand why the Most Merciful Allah made munafiqs who claim to be Muslims when they are not. Yet in His Compassion He made them and warned us about them. What these false Muslims say is really not our concern. As you know, there will be false Prophets who would attempt to hurt Islam by mentioning their false Gods in place of Allah, and whose followers will have a sorry end in the hereafter.

  32. tajender United Arab Emirates Internet Explorer Windows says:

    Sat Jun 15, 2013 2:37AM GMT
    2
    1

    5

    The violence that originally targeted Rohingya Muslims in western Myanmar is beginning to spread to other parts of the country, where Muslims who have been granted citizenship are now being attacked, according to the website burmamuslims.org.
    Related Interviews:

    ‘US overlooks Rohingya suffering’
    ‘Myanmar leaders must stand trial’

    Related Viewpoints:

    Suu Kyi, Western proxy in Myanmar

    A meeting of over 200 Myanmar Buddhist monks on how to end the violence against Muslims in the country has ended with a call for rule of law.

    In a statement issued on Friday at the end of the two-day conference, held at a monastery in Hmawbi, about 32 kilometers from the former capital Yangon, the monks said that they seek peace and accused the media of maligning their peaceful religion.

    Conference spokesman Dhammapiya said, “We have to ascertain if the monks who took part in the violence were fake or genuine monks. It has to be investigated and there should be rule of law to stop the violence.”

    According to media reports, some monks were armed and encouraged the violence against the Muslims.

    A day earlier, Dhammapiya told reporters, “We are just requesting you to write the news with the right information.”

    “There are many media that report ethically. But there are some which get backing from some sort of organizations,” he said, without elaborating. “We feel that it’s not balanced.”

    The violence that originally targeted Rohingya Muslims in western Myanmar is beginning to spread to other parts of the country, where Muslims who have been granted citizenship are now being attacked, according to the website burmamuslims.org.

    About 800,000 Rohingyas in the western state of Rakhine are deprived of citizenship rights due to the policy of discrimination that has denied them the right of citizenship and made them vulnerable to acts of violence and persecution, expulsion, and displacement.

    The Myanmar government has so far refused to extricate the stateless Rohingyas from their citizenship limbo, despite international pressure to give them a legal status.

    Rohingya Muslims have faced torture, neglect, and repression in Myanmar for many years.

    Hundreds of Rohingyas are believed to have been killed and thousands displaced in recent attacks by extremists who call themselves Buddhists.

    The extremists frequently attack Rohingyas and have set fire to their homes in several villages in Rakhine. Myanmar army forces allegedly provide the fanatics containers of petrol for torching the houses of Muslim villagers, who are then forced to flee.

    Myanmar’s government has been accused of failing to protect the Muslim minority.

    Myanmar opposition leader Aung San Suu Kyi has also come under fire for her stance on the violence. The Nobel Peace laureate has refused to censure the Myanmar military for its persecution of the Rohingyas, although she recently condemned the decision by local officials in Rakhine state to enforce a two-child policy on Rohingya Muslims.

    Rohingyas are said to be Muslim descendants of Persian, Turkish, Bengali, and Pathan origin, who migrated to Myanmar as early as the 8th century.

    Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch have issued separate statements, calling on Myanmar to take action to protect the Rohingya Muslim population against extremists.

  33. kaalchakra United States Safari  Android 4.0.4 LG-MS770 Build/IMM76I says:

    Tajender, I don’t know why these Buddhists, Hindus, Jains, Polytheists, shintoists, and some misguided Christians and Jews hate Muslims and don’t let them live in peace ANYWHERE. It’s probably jealousy. What do you think?

  34. kaalchakra United States Safari  Android 4.0.4 LG-MS770 Build/IMM76I says:

    Presenting the Islamic perspective on everything, as Rex and Tajender do from the insider and outsider positions respectively, is to raise the level to Islamic heights. Why do people see it as pulling matters down into the gutter? That is just bigotry.

  35. sunny Germany Mozilla Firefox Windows says:

    to kaal….

    It is muslims who have gone on a rampage against non-muslims since 1400 years of aggressive war-making, robberies, rapes and imperialism. Why do you muslims forget that? Why do you try to hide your own aggresions and imperialism?

    Islam was created in Makkah and in that noisy-obscene-filthy-unholy city no non-muslims are disturbing you (=zombies of islamic fascism= from practising your bloody rituals, idiocies and emotions.

    BUT, outside of Makkah islam is an alien imperialist ideology and has to be kicked out so that non-muslims and non-arabs can live in safety and self-respect and freedom from fascism in the name of a tribal arab god-concept.

    Even pakistanis will slowly realize that islam has ruined them and will ruin them more. Some totally zombified pakistanis like kaal will have it more difficult.

    You have to admit that islam and muslims were and are the aggressors since 1400 years.
    So don’t pretend innocence.

  36. sunny Germany Mozilla Firefox Windows says:

    kaal wrote:

    “Presenting the Islamic perspective on everything, as Rex and Tajender do from the insider and outsider positions respectively, is to raise the level to Islamic heights.”

    Look at the effects of an islamic indoctrination on tajender and to what heights he raises the islamic positions:

    Just read this quote from a post by tajender:

    in “”Thoughts on leaving USA:
    :
    June 14, 2013 at 6:26 pm”"

    :

    “abhi kee liye kahooga,

    chal uth bahanchod apni dholak utha,
    gala besura hai,trannum purana,
    yahan ma chudanein kee koshish na karna.”

    This filthy language and attitude is the result of kuran and islam.

    Did kaal not read it?
    Does he still think highly of tajender and rex?

  37. ibn quddus United Arab Emirates Mozilla Firefox Windows says:

    t is muslims who have gone on a rampage against non-muslims since 1400 years of aggressive war-making, robberies, rapes and imperialism. Why do you muslims forget that? Why do you try to hide your own aggresions and imperialism?

    chutie tell me where

  38. kaalchakra United States Mozilla Firefox Windows says:

    Tajender, the only reason one can think of why these Buddhists, Hindus, Jains, Shintoists, atheists, and some Christians and Jews hide their aggression and imperialism against Muslims EVERYWHERE is pure jealousy. In their hearts everybody else must know that they are wrong and Muslims are right, so they to try to hurt innocent Muslims who live peacefully with everyone else and among themselves.

    ———————

    sunny, those words probably do not sound right to non-Muslims. Yet they are perfectly in order with Islam. The least that a Muslim can do against a defiantly disobedient unbeliever who insists on engaging in argumentation is to use strong words against him or her.

    I see nothing wrong at all in what Tajender says or does. He is acting as he should.

  39. tajender United Arab Emirates Internet Explorer Windows says:

    Tajender, the only reason one can think of why these Buddhists, Hindus, Jains, Shintoists, atheists, and some Christians and Jews hide their aggression and imperialism against Muslims EVERYWHERE is pure jealousy

    no.allof them u mentioned are mentally controlled by zoinists.reason for war is corridor which they want to take their booty.to take oil and gas from central asia they need passsage through afghanistan and port of karachi.to take oil from kurdistan they want iran.
    their economies are down.capitalism is failing.there are 26 million unemployed in eu.in america lot of problems are going on.everyday there is voilence there.they have jobs to cheap countries to make moreprofit like china india and bangladesh.countries have no work.so they have to fabricate lies and wars to provide employment to people..media is in their hands.apne bchae jaal mein khud phans chuke hai.

  40. kaalchakra United States Mozilla Firefox Windows says:

    tajender, that seems more sensible. But I would hazard a guess that Jewish zionists do not need to directly control the world. May be, we can hypothesize localized versions of zionists – Christian zionists, Buddhist zionists, Hindu and Shinto zionists, atheist zionists, and such, who are organized in a lose confederation through which they share resources, information, and motivations against Muslims. Otherwise it makes no sense why EVERYONE pretty much dislikes and engages in violence against Muslims who are taught to be, by nature, peaceful and productive. The Holy Quran, when read enough times and made part of one’s internal constitution, teaches people to work hard, cooperate with others, and keep truth above all.

  41. sunny Germany Mozilla Firefox Windows says:

    kuran teaches to practise closed-minded-ness, machoism, fascism, aggression and dishonesty.
    muslims prove this everyday.
    kaal, rex, tajender etc. are the proofs.

    Muslims are the most violent, cowardly and deceiful people now on the earth now. Muslims are the biggest haters of muslims and muslims fear the muslims most. That is why they also lie a lot. And then blame zionists or brahmins for it.

  42. Satyam United States Google Chrome Windows says:

    Watch this for the superiority of Islamic value system. Kaffirs really do not deserve the presence of islam in their lands.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LbpAXRfbE-A&feature=player_embedded

  43. Bub Pakistan Google Chrome Windows says:

    The Quran also warned us of the coming of the Promised Messiah. Ever thought about that?
    At times, you need to open your mind to the signals that Allah is sending you instead of following everything the Mullahs tell you.

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